[English Longbow] Permitted loose style Longbow

English Bowman

Well-known member
I believe GNAS rules allow one of:
- marks on the limb
- rubber bands
- artificial point of aim on the ground

They also allow a kisser on the string - but I have never seen anybody use one

Tom
They do for target, as they basically use BLBS rules.

This is for target only. Any sighting aids are banned from field.

Daniel
 

DavidH

New member
My first Portsmouth

Well it appears I've been doing what most people see as the best way to shoot, and gap shooting seems to win out -using a constant anchor position. I've gone for the second finger at the mouth, at least indoors. When I'm really concentrating this can produce suprisingly accurate results - my first end produced a 10,9,8!

I'm certainly not asking for compliments as I have a long way to go, but I amazed myself with a score of 316 on my first ever longbow portsmouth. (some in the club say its better than my recurve but they jest - I hope!)

The risk of too careful aim of course is that it could take away the sheer relaxed joy of shooting with a longbow, which was my reason for taking it up in the first place.
 

Little Miss Purple

The American
Fonz Awardee
Ironman
American Shoot
Well it appears I've been doing what most people see as the best way to shoot, and gap shooting seems to win out -using a constant anchor position. I've gone for the second finger at the mouth, at least indoors. When I'm really concentrating this can produce suprisingly accurate results - my first end produced a 10,9,8!

I'm certainly not asking for compliments as I have a long way to go, but I amazed myself with a score of 316 on my first ever longbow portsmouth. (some in the club say its better than my recurve but they jest - I hope!)

The risk of too careful aim of course is that it could take away the sheer relaxed joy of shooting with a longbow, which was my reason for taking it up in the first place.

fantastic - my longbow pb is 288 :beer:
 

Macbow

New member
...The risk of too careful aim of course is that it could take away the sheer relaxed joy of shooting with a longbow, which was my reason for taking it up in the first place.
Like anything if you put in the concentrated focused work in the early stages it will become more relaxed - more instinctive or gapstinctive - as your shooting progresses. Top US tournament trad archer Rod Jenkins gives a superb demonstration and explanation of his pinpoint accurate gap system in the Masters Of The Barebow Vol 1 DVD.
The main downside of gap shooting is the chance of developing target panic through the conditioned response of acquiring the gap in relation to the spot then releasing. To stop this happening try to vary your time holding at anchor during practice. Longer periods of holding at full draw may not be good for your longbow (I'm not an ELB user so you'll know best) but it stops your subconscious from going into a habitual automatic release as soon as you see the spot. Jay Kidwell explains it very well in his excellent book Instinctive Archery Insights.
 
G

Geoff

Guest
Longbow Loose technique

Hi Guys,

I am new here so be gentle ok.
I just wanted to give my opinion concerning the longbow loose.
I live and work in Hungary and I am a member of an archery club here. In feb there will be an IFAA competition held here and I have heard that the 3 finger under the arrow is not permitted,, HOW VERY SAD. I have checked the rules of IFAA and it seems that the 3 finger release is good for reflex, and compound in various categories and that it is only the longbow shooters that are being restricted.
Well I do shoot using the 3 finger under the arrow and I will not change for such a pathetic misconception even if this means that I will not be able to enter the competition.
A man must stand by his beliefs and I stand by mine...
I will not change to the Mediterranean loose on principle. the old berks who came up with this ruling obviously have a fear of the great longbow shooters and their skill...
There is no proof or evidence whatsoever to support the idea or even concept that the 3 finger below arrow loose is in any way superior to the Mediterranean loose. Assuming in both cases that the index finger is touching the arrow nock. so come on IFAA stop punishing the longbow shooters of the world and start playing fair. Whats going on with the Historic category ? if we cannot use the historical techniques?
:thumbsdow
 

steve58

New member
I'm no expert on the history of all this, but I thought the two fingered gesture inviting someone to "go away" derived from the English archers who showed the French a thing or two? A quick flick through my copy of "The Great Warbow" suggests that at that period archers seemed to draw with two fingers, one over the arrow, one under. Perhaps this suggests that the "one over, two under" loose may be as historically appropriate as anything? Or am I completely wrong? I look forward to learning more about the history of various styles of loose... (why is it called the mediterranean loose anyway? and how and why did it come to be the most widespread?)
 

English Bowman

Well-known member
Try reading Toxophilus. It's not the easiest book to read dating to 1545, but well worth it. Ascham describes the Mediterranian loose in it, so yes there is historical evidence for its use.

Daniel
 
G

Geoff

Guest
Dictatorship

I do agree that the Mediterranean loose is historical but so are many other types of loose.
My problem is this,,,many archers like myself use the 3 under loose, not for string walking as the index finger is in contact with the arrow nock, we do this because it is more comfortable to shoot this way and as I said before there is no evidence that the 3 under has any advantage at all over other loose techniques.
It is purely preference which you use and I therefor feel that the BIG BOYS governing bodies should not be able to dictate what is and what is not to be used in this area, or are we to see a future ruling as to which colour bow bags we can use.
Remember this, if it were not for the archers there would not be a big boy club and it does seem as though the governing bodies are very good at ignoring the people that count, The archers themselves,
If you check out the IFAA's web site for each catagory you will see that for reflex and compound bows in some catagories, the 3 under is fine but, not for the longbow boys, the minority.
If the IFAA want to push the point of historically correct then they should ban all modern reflex and compounds too, after all we have no historical evidence of full reflex kits or compounds being used in any famous battles in history...
Sorry to be hard with this but I do feel as though this is like a coin of two sides and they are both heads.:yawn:
 
M

mathewsmainliner

Guest
you could always try a little cheat that some of the top recurvers use.
that is to just place your bottem finger on the string, do not us it for releasing the arrow, just rest it there, you will then be shooting with one finger above and one below, but if a judge has good enough eyes to see you doing this he/she will repremand you or through you out of any competition. But i know of several archers both recurve and long bow who use this method, as long as you bottem finger is in contact with the string, even if it is not doing any of the pulling (draw) this may help.
 
G

Geoff

Guest
Iffa

As a point of interest I did write to the IFAA last friday and asked them for a justifiable reason concerning the 3 under ban.
Well I have as yet received NO REPLY :thumbsdow
I will keep you all posted on this subject as it does seem to interest a lot of people.
As for my club here in Hungary, 3 of the our longbow shooters here have now resigned from all IFAA ruled competitions, including myself.
The IFAA say that all judgments on rules are made by their technical committee but, maybe they need an E-mail committee too :raspberry

PS mathewsmainliner,, thanks for the tip :yummy:
 
G

Geoff

Guest
Waiting

Well it has now been 1 week since I wrote to the IFAA asking for an explanation for the longbow 3 under ban in competition..
GUESS WHAT ? still no reply.. as I said ,, it is all power politics :yuck:
We clearly need a global organization to govern the governing bodies who obviously think the archers are not important enough to talk to. :cheerful:
 

English Bowman

Well-known member
We clearly need a global organization to govern the governing bodies who obviously think the archers are not important enough to talk to. :cheerful:
I'd like to see that, but then we have F.I.T.A. It would be nice if F.I.T.A. could join forces with the I.F.A.A. and N.F.A.S. but I think that there's more chance of World peace, and a cure for cancer than that one happening.
 

Phil Sheffield

New member
I use the 3 under technique for both my recurve with sights or as a barebow and with a long bow.
This is the style that I have found suits me best, and no interference with the release from the top finger's tab.
Whilst browsing I noticed this thread which I read with interest, even though it is 9 years old now, as I am looking for a new longbow but it seems that I should have it tillered to suit my style, to possibly enhance the longevity of my new long bow when I get one.

I have been told about other rules in archery that appear to apply in formal competition.
Any rule that does not have a satisfactory justification to me just seems petty. A person with arthritus or similar affliction may not use a release aid for any bow other than a compound bow for example which seems be not at all enabling. Rules that dictate the preferences of others about marks on your bow or elastic bands, clothing and string walking are two that come immediately to mind and now it seems that where you put your fingers on your own bowstring is being dictated also.

Is anyone able to state please whether or not this, yet another, seemingly petty rule is still inforced by some or all of the apparent dinosaurs that seem to govern the sport at competition level, and is anyone able to justify it?
 

Raven's_Eye

Active member
Ironman
I use the 3 under technique for both my recurve with sights or as a barebow and with a long bow.
This is the style that I have found suits me best, and no interference with the release from the top finger's tab.
Whilst browsing I noticed this thread which I read with interest, even though it is 9 years old now, as I am looking for a new longbow but it seems that I should have it tillered to suit my style, to possibly enhance the longevity of my new long bow when I get one.

I have been told about other rules in archery that appear to apply in formal competition.
Any rule that does not have a satisfactory justification to me just seems petty. A person with arthritus or similar affliction may not use a release aid for any bow other than a compound bow for example which seems be not at all enabling. Rules that dictate the preferences of others about marks on your bow or elastic bands, clothing and string walking are two that come immediately to mind and now it seems that where you put your fingers on your own bowstring is being dictated also.

Is anyone able to state please whether or not this, yet another, seemingly petty rule is still inforced by some or all of the apparent dinosaurs that seem to govern the sport at competition level, and is anyone able to justify it?
Some of the rules are there for when shooting competitively to put people on a level playing field. So for example the release aids can only be used on compounds. because they give a cleaner more precise loose than 3 fingers someone using one on a recurve would have an advantage over someone using a tab.

As for the bands/marks on bows/ground markers with longbows, they are in the rules, but don't all together with some people's views of what shooting a longbow is, so those that don't use them put themselves at a disadvantage.

The clothing rule is much more lax than it was, it used to be to keep the sport smart, respectable and uniform, which there is nothing wrong with other sports have/had similar rules e.g. tennis, cricket.

The finger position on your longbow string is down to how it is made, as you put your fingers under it changes the distribution of weight on the limbs, which will cause more damage to the bow.
 

Phil Sheffield

New member
Some of the rules are there for when shooting competitively to put people on a level playing field. So for example the release aids can only be used on compounds. because they give a cleaner more precise loose than 3 fingers someone using one on a recurve would have an advantage over someone using a tab.
Not something I agree with when you consider that some people would be able to continue taking part in a sport with an aid that otherwise would be unable to do so. If the arguement you present is to hold up then they should not allow release aids for any discipline.

As for the bands/marks on bows/ground markers with longbows, they are in the rules, but don't all together with some people's views of what shooting a longbow is, so those that don't use them put themselves at a disadvantage.
I was not aware that sight marks were allowed.. that is good to hear..

The clothing rule is much more lax than it was, it used to be to keep the sport smart, respectable and uniform, which there is nothing wrong with other sports have/had similar rules e.g. tennis, cricket.
Tennis cricket etc are team sports and one expects similar kit or uniforms to be worn when in competition. Archery whilst it may be in inter-something competition/event/whatever.. remains essentially an individual activity and I really can not be convinced to see a need for dress codes other than please someone else's concept of what is to them aesthetically acceptable.

The finger position on your longbow string is down to how it is made, as you put your fingers under it changes the distribution of weight on the limbs, which will cause more damage to the bow.
Flamez mentioned that and I have read, only today, about that perticular difficulty arising and that if the preference of how one holds the string is already chosen it an be taken into account when the bow is being tillered. As regards anyone else attempting to impose practices of their choosing and excluding those I would choose to adopt then sorry I am not going to allow people with that sort of arrogant sense of self importance to do that to me. It would not be as though I was doing something that would give me an unfair advantage that other people would be excluded from adopting if they so wished.
 

blakey

Active member
Not something I agree with when you consider that some people would be able to continue taking part in a sport with an aid that otherwise would be unable to do so. If the arguement you present is to hold up then they should not allow release aids for any discipline.
There is an accepted hierarchy of degrees of difficulty in shooting in competition. Compound is the easiest by far, longbow the hardest. That is reflected in the scores. Restrictions are there in every category to give a level playing field in that discipline. If you shoot with the perceived advantage of a mechanical aid from another category, then you are shooting in that category. So if you want to shoot longbow with a release aid, you can, but you will be shooting as a compound. I have friends who shoot recurve with crippled hands. If they want to compete, they have to make a choice. Do they shoot recurve as a recurve, ie with a tab, or as a compound, with an aid? If this is seen as a disadvantage then the answer is either to shoot as a compound, or simply not compete. :)
 
Top