8125 Seems Thick!

albatross

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I just purchased, from an archery site, a spool of what is supposed to be 8125. It is white and non-waxed. I thought the strands looked a bit thicker than shop purchased 8125 - which is waxed. It reminded me of fastflight. An 18 strand string is like a piece of rope. Have I been done?

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Timid Toad

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From a private seller on an archery site? What does it say on the spool?
 

Rabid Hamster

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I felt 8125 was thick but I had to move to it from 8190 after I couldnt seem to get 8190 anymore. did feel very chunky and had to cut strands down drastically. think I dropped to 16 on my last string.
 

albatross

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Thanks for the replies. There was no wrapping label But there was the usual '8125' sticker on the underside of the spool. I looked to see if it had been tampered with but it looks the original. Even 16 strands is thicker in diameter than my 'shop purchased' 8125. On the plus side. If it is 'genuine' and I have to reduce the number of strands to get a good nock fit. I will use less material and get more strings from the spool! Is the 'waxed' version thinner to the wax making the fibres cling to each other more tightly?
 

Stretch

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If your string is coming out noticeably thicker then it seems unlikely it is 8125 unless (maybe) it is a colour like silver which can have a ton of wax on it. (When you run your nail down it does it clog with coloured wax?). I have tried a bunch of 8125 and 8125G colours and never had one come up noticeably thick.

Would seem likely that someone has tampered with the reel. If it doesn’t stretch for ever it is something like DY02. If it stretches forever it is Dacron. If it feels harsh could be something like 450. You won’t get more strings off the roll as they are generally done by weight so a fatter strand will have a shorter total length on the spool.

Dacron tends to be quite a round thread. Most Dyneema threads are a bit flat (not sure if all).

If it feels totally different to shoot from your shop bought string at the same(ish) diameter then it is Dacron.

Apologies if I am being overly negative... I just can’t see it, especially if the plastic and label were removed from the reel.

2p

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albatross

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Thanks for the reply. I am beginning to think it is not 8125. I made an 18 strand string using the 'genuine' 8125 and got a 'G' nock large groove to get a 'nice' fit. I had made an 18 strand string from the 'suspect' reel. I had to cut out 6 strands to get the same nock fit. I suspect it is Dacron when I compare it to some D50 I also have. I guess I will just use it in the garden next year! Thanks for your replies. It is white and wax free.
 

Stretch

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12 strands matching 18 strand does sound like Dacron but there are similar sized dyneema and Vectran blends over the years. However, white can be a difficult colour for many of those so Dacron seems the most likely.

Stretch
 

albatross

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Out of curiosity I did a 'stretch test' on this string material. I put 6 strand string 44 1/2" on my stretching jig. I tried to stretch it. I managed about 1" with a lot of force on my screw thread device. After 48hrs I took the tension off and measured the string = 44 1/2". I did the same with some Dacron 55 and it stretched about 2 1/2". After 12 hrs when I released the tension it had stretched 1" form the original. So it's not a Dacron material. Has the diameter of 8125 changed over time by the manufacturers?
 

Stretch

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8125 has not changed. However, there are plenty of other BCY Dyneema based string materials that it could be. Dynaflight97 was thicker as was DY02. They were about 14 strand being equivalent to 18 8125.

Maybe the factory sticker fell off and someone put the wrong one back on.

Based on my experience with DY97 and DY02 the garden shed is the right place for it :p But some people did like those fibres.

Stretch
 

dfrois

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I know this is an old thread, but I am placing this information here in the hope that it may help someone who finds it while researching string materials.

According to BCY, they had (have?) another product that is made from exactly the same material as 8125 (Dyneema SK78). It was called Dynaflight 10, and the difference between it and 8125 was that DF10 had much thicker strands, and therefore required much fewer strands for a recurve string: only 12 to 16. I have two spools of it, and indeed 12 to 14 strands are enough for a recurve. Maybe 16 for 50+ lbs, or compounds. I have used as few as 8 strands, with no ill effects that I could see.

Even at 12 strands, it is quite thick, very stiff, and seems equivalent to 18-20 strands of 8125 (but I do not have much experience with 8125: only made 3 or 4 strings with it). The spools I have are waxed very profusely from the factory.

BCY still have a product that is the same, or very similar, but it is now called Force 10, and is marketed as a crossbow string material.

I have been using DF10 for 3 or 4 years now, and I think it is good enough, with some care while string making. But, then again, I'm not an Olympian, so YMMV.

So, the OP's mystery spool could have been Dynaflight 10: same stuff as 8125, but built with much thicker strands.
 

albatross

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Well that is a surprise post! It does seem to be the symptoms that I encountered. That spool I brought has been used to tie up my tomato plants and others - probably the best place for it - not worth risking my Uukha limbs with it.

Thanks for the reply.
 

geoffretired

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Does BCY make bow string? I thought they made materials in string form and bundle them onto spools of convenient sizes for different end users. Likewise for the strand thicknesses. Some end users needing thicker stands and others needing thinner ones.
Perhaps a thicker stand of string XX looked suitable for bow string so was sold on as such. If thick strands of dacron work........
 

dfrois

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Funny you should mention Uukha. I recently acquired a pair of EX1s, and had to make a string for them. I made it from DF10, 12 strand, and it is shooting beautifully with it. No ill effects, but it still has very few shots.

But, I have been using DF10 strings on other bows/limbs, for more than 5 years now, and never noticed any weird issues. That includes Win&Win ProAccents, Innos Power, Border TX40 and Hex5, and no issues. And that includes thousands of shots, in all conditions. I have built strings with it from 8 to 14 strands, and never had an issue that could be attributed to the string material (other than too much wax from the factory).
Dsiclaimer: Maximum poundage I used it on was 42 lbs. on Olympic recurves. I never used it on compounds, or traditional bows.

I have, more recently, built strings with 8125, and, as expected, behaviour was pretty much the same (had to use more strands, of course). I did find a difference with 8190, which seemed harsher when shooting. Didn't like it. Maybe it's just habit.

On another note, about geoffretired's question: maybe there is a huge gap in my knowledge, but I thought BCY and Brownwell were the 2 main manufacturers of bow string material, for many years now. The specific products vary in material(s), colors and thickness, and, sometimes, in strand thickness, but they have many more different products than different materials. And, of course, they do products for other purposes, not archery related. At least, that's what I thought was the state of things, when I paused on my archery, due to the pandemic. Has this changed? If so, I would surely like to know about it.
 

dfrois

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I don't know much about the manufacturing of HMPE, or UHMWPE, but, from what I have read, the main markets for those are climbing (mountaineering) and sailing. That's for the raw materials. I would have thought that the amount used, worldwide, for archery is but a small fraction of what is produced in total.

But, of course, this is all hear-say, or read-say (so to speak). I don't really know, first-hand, that any of this is factual. Some of it may be Internet-lore...so, if anyone else knows more, or different, about this, please let us all know, so that I, for one, can correct or enlarge my knowledge. I love to learn about these kinds of things, and sometimes what you read (despite much care with the sources) can, and often is, wrong.

And, geoffretired, cheers. I read many of your posts, and only wish there were more people like you, on all forums!
 

dfrois

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Found this on the website of a rope manufacturing company:


ABOUT HMPE ROPE
What is HMPE?
HMPE is a chemical name for high modulus polyethylene an increasingly popular material used to make different types of rope. HMPE is also known as ultrahigh molecular weight polyethylene (UHMWPE) offering a range of performance and durability properties depending on grade and consistency of the fiber make up.
Buying HMPE rope
The quality and properties with HMPE can vary depending on the fibre, meaning that there will be marginal changes in creep, life span and fatigue.
Sourcing your product from reputable manufactures with help provide peace of mind that:
  • You are getting the best grade of fiber
  • Testing has been carried out to check the quality
  • You'll have access to technical support where required
Different HMPEs in the marketplace
In the marketplace the leading brand of HMPE is Dyneema, English Braids are an official Dyneema partner. The fibre is produced in a patented gel spinning process in which the fibres are drawn, heated, elongated, and cooled. Stretching and spinning leads to molecular alignment, high crystallization, and low density. Dyneema® has extremely long molecular chains that transfer load more effectively to the polymer backbone. So it's stronger at the same weight or lighter at the same strength than alternatives.
Generic HMPE yarns don't always achieve the same consistency as the Dyneema fibres which can impact the technical specifications.

They mention Dyneema products: SK99, SK78, SK38 and DM20.

I can post the link (it is a public website), but I don't know if it's allowed.
 

geoffretired

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I guess that the fiber is made for mass use in industries that weave fabrics or stitch them into clothes, bag type containers, sails, ropes etc. I could imagine small spools like the ones we see in archery outlets, are made a convenient size for lighter industrial use and archery uses those. In a similar way fletchings are probably moulded from plastics that have been designed for much more serious purposes.
 

Senlac

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Playing with various string materials (for recurve) over the last few years it’s been BCY 8190 with occasional forays into BCY-X (brutal stuff for recurves, like piano wire!). Anyway, to get to the point… I recently backed-off to 8125G and it felt really nice - not as hard as 8190. But I then ran out of 8125G, and horror…. BCY have ceased to make it - and the few retailers who say they can supply it in fact do not have any. So… I now have a (1/2 lb) reel of 8125, and we’ll see how it feels……
 

dfrois

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If what I have read is correct, you can still get 8125 (sort of...): BCY sells a product called Force 10, which is, supposedly, exactly the same material (100% Dyneema SK78) as 8125, only with thicker strands. The same as the discontinued Dynaflight 10, which I use. If you can get a hold of a small spool of that, I bet it would feel the same as 8125, for the same string thickness.

Of course, you would have to use much fewer strands, or divide the Force 10 strands (which is not easy)...just an idea.
I know that, when I run out of DF10, that's what I will try.
 
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