[English Longbow] Bowyers knot

DavidH

New member
Does anyone else have problems with the bowyers knot? Just recently I've found that its slipping and changing my brace height by as much as an inch within a few hours of shooting.
 

Martin Heelis

New member
Ironman
Yes, same problem here. I wonder if it only works properly with lots of wax on it? Decided that if I ever manage to get shooting again with it I'm gonna get a double flemish loop string.
 

Del the Cat

Well-known member
IMO, they are no good with modern (slippery) string materials. May be ok with a linen or hemp string.
I only ever use continuous loop.
Other problem is that as the string slips the nocking point shifts too... basically no good.
Del
 

Raven's_Eye

Active member
Ironman
I've not really had a problem really. How many times do you wrap the cord around the loop? I generally do it 4 times, that way the bow is also holding the string in place as well.
 

DavidH

New member
I wrap mine 4 or 5 times - still get the problem, I'm thinking of whipping it once I've got the correct brace height, which seems to take me forever;)
 

Raven's_Eye

Active member
Ironman
If you've got some trailing string once the knot is tight on your bow, just knot the trailing string so it can't slip.
 

Bald Eagle

New member
Also, make sure you have the lay of the string the same way on the loop, if not, it'll be like a centre serving served against the twist and will fail!
 

DavidH

New member
Also, make sure you have the lay of the string the same way on the loop, if not, it'll be like a centre serving served against the twist and will fail!
Forgive my ignorance, this is the first string that I've ever need a bowyers knot and that piece of advice has gone to totally over my head!

Incidentally a friend on the line yesterday was insisting that this is a timber hitch. I know its also called that but which came first?

According to wiki - "The timber hitch is an old knot. It is first known to have been mentioned in a nautical source circa 1625[4] and illustrated in 1762."

That would suggest that it was first known as a bowyers knot.
 

DavidH

New member
I wonder if anybody has tried other knots instead of the bowyers knot, I was chatting to an old archer friend and he said he used to use a butchers knot. I've not tried it yet, And what about Native American bows or oriental bows - what did they use? There must be a simple knot that doesn't slip?
 

Anglian Archer

New member
Forgive my ignorance, this is the first string that I've ever need a bowyers knot and that piece of advice has gone to totally over my head!

Incidentally a friend on the line yesterday was insisting that this is a timber hitch. I know its also called that but which came first?

According to wiki - "The timber hitch is an old knot. It is first known to have been mentioned in a nautical source circa 1625[4] and illustrated in 1762."

That would suggest that it was first known as a bowyers knot.
There's some information on the Bowyers Knot in the following publication that you might find useful:

http://www.archery.org/UserFiles/Do..._downloads/Coaches_Manual_Lev2/09_Longbow.pdf
 

Laurie

New member
I'm new to this but my bowyers knot slipped too......basically a bowline so I use a bowline and lock it off, No more problems. Now longbow being a, possibly, more purist discipline...no sights etc., why bother with a crimped nocking point? This again must be a fairly recent practice to define it in this manner. Or am I wrong???
 

Bald Eagle

New member
Yes Laurie ,you are new to this!!A properly tied bowyers/timber hitch will not slip and allows adjustment for string stretch, unlike a bowline. Nobody uses a crimped nock point, they are used initially to get the correct nock point and then a dental floss nock point is whipped on the string. Brass nock sets wreck tabs!
 

Tuck

New member
Yes Laurie ,you are new to this!!A properly tied bowyers/timber hitch will not slip and allows adjustment for string stretch, unlike a bowline. Nobody uses a crimped nock point, they are used initially to get the correct nock point and then a dental floss nock point is whipped on the string. Brass nock sets wreck tabs!
And wreck arms....ouch!



Eat, Drink, Shoot, Enjoy.
 

Laurie

New member
Yes Laurie ,you are new to this!!A properly tied bowyers/timber hitch will not slip and allows adjustment for string stretch, unlike a bowline. Nobody uses a crimped nock point, they are used initially to get the correct nock point and then a dental floss nock point is whipped on the string. Brass nock sets wreck tabs!
Indeed I am new, which is what I said? Thank you re the bowyers knot (which is basically a bowline). It seems many out there are finding (for what ever reason) it is slipping. Indeed a bowline (under load) should not slip, that is why it was developed, and yet off load is easy to adjust. Just like a bowyers knot indeed! Re the knocking point...why then are so many talking about it, and so many bows have them? Perhaps it would be less of a generalisation that maybe they should not? have a brass knocking point, if that is the consensus: not that they don't, as evidently they do!:cheerful: As a matter of interest, how would brass knocking points wreck tabs, as all recurvers (sorry...most!!) use both???? I've never heard mention of this in recurve archery? I'm quite new to that too .........
 

Rik

Supporter
Supporter
Indeed I am new, which is what I said? Thank you re the bowyers knot (which is basically a bowline). It seems many out there are finding (for what ever reason) it is slipping. Indeed a bowline (under load) should not slip, that is why it was developed, and yet off load is easy to adjust. Just like a bowyers knot indeed! Re the knocking point...why then are so many talking about it, and so many bows have them? Perhaps it would be less of a generalisation that maybe they should not? have a brass knocking point, if that is the consensus: not that they don't, as evidently they do!:cheerful: As a matter of interest, how would brass knocking points wreck tabs, as all recurvers (sorry...most!!) use both???? I've never heard mention of this in recurve archery? I'm quite new to that too .........
I think you'll find that the most common advice given regarding brass nocksets (for any discipline) is to take them off and put a proper nocking point on...
 

Timid Toad

Moderator
Staff member
Supporter
Fonz Awardee
Ironman
I've never used a brass nocking point on longbow, flatbow or recurve. Temporary point with masking tape followed by polyester sewing thread and a blob of bostik.
Brass nocking points hurt, ruin tabs, slow down the string and if over crimped can nip through the serving.
 

Bald Eagle

New member
For a start, a timber hitch or bowyers hitch is nothing like a bowline!! Timber/bowyers hitches are tied like an overhand knot and then twisted 3 or 4 times back on the main string and are designed to slip and pull tight on whatever they are around. A bowline is not meant to slip, if it did I would have lost many casualties during my time in the fire service rescuing them from pits etc! If you use a brass nock set or even 2 on your string, check the damage on your tab that they cause, also, you lose 2 fps in speed, 4 fps if you have 2 on. Shops put them on for initial set up and nock point, it's up to you whether you want to leave it/them on or not. I doubt many top archers use them for the reasons stated!
 

chuffalump

Well-known member
My tab was scored by brass nocks. I use tied waxed cotton nocking points now. In fact, this weekend gone I reduced them to a single layer of thread as an experiment. Extra low profile now. :D
 
My tab was scored by brass nocks. I use tied waxed cotton nocking points now. In fact, this weekend gone I reduced them to a single layer of thread as an experiment. Extra low profile now. :D
Pah - I just use the worn patch of the serving as MY nocking point - beat that for low profile!


;)
 
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