Longrod flex and aiming

GoneBad

Member
At a shoot this weekend I was chatting to a top rank factory shooter about my Apex8. He said he was going to get one for the indoor season. Anyway, he pointed out how much my long rod flexes ( 30" cartel carbon with 10.5 ounces on the end) and that a totally stiff longrod, like his Doinker Platinum HI-mod, would improve on how steady my hold is.
I rushed home and looked up the price of this shiny new toy :jaw-dropp and his other recommendation, b-stinger premier+, made me wince.
My question is, will a flexing long rod affect stability? I'm not talking fishing rod whipping here. I can get my cartel to bend about 20mm if I grab it at both ends and really heave. The principal of what he's saying is that a small tremor along the arm will cause the longrod to flex, which will move the end weight and cause a pendulum effect. Do you agree that such tiny movements will make a noticable difference?
If this is case, can you give me any recomendations for a super stiff longrod that doesn't require a mortgage?
 

T101

Active member
At a shoot this weekend I was chatting to a top rank factory shooter about my Apex8. He said he was going to get one for the indoor season. Anyway, he pointed out how much my long rod flexes ( 30" cartel carbon with 10.5 ounces on the end) and that a totally stiff longrod, like his Doinker Platinum HI-mod, would improve on how steady my hold is.
I rushed home and looked up the price of this shiny new toy :jaw-dropp and his other recommendation, b-stinger premier+, made me wince.
My question is, will a flexing long rod affect stability? I'm not talking fishing rod whipping here. I can get my cartel to bend about 20mm if I grab it at both ends and really heave. The principal of what he's saying is that a small tremor along the arm will cause the longrod to flex, which will move the end weight and cause a pendulum effect. Do you agree that such tiny movements will make a noticable difference?
If this is case, can you give me any recomendations for a super stiff longrod that doesn't require a mortgage?
i'd say you would definately feel a benefit with that much weight on the end. i noticed when i switched from my easton ace to doinker fatty, and i'm using much less weight thatn 10oz.

did some research b4 i bought fatty and although the platinums r stiffer, but not a great deal, and smaller diameter, i couldn't justify the extra price. can't recommend the fatty enough. think i've seen it for about ?80/90

noticed the new fivics ce7's @quicks, dunno if they r stiff enough but under ?70.

not unheard of for people to put arrow shafts inside the long rod to stiffen it right up. adds a fair weight though even with hollow carbons. but cheap!
 

jimlee

New member
T101 beat me to it in suggesting the Doinker Fatty, it might be worth looking on Ebay for one or something similar coz us archers are generally gadget tarts and must have this years super duper self aiming bit of kit and end up selling perfectly good gear.

Cheers, Jim.
 

T101

Active member
Why Moose? Are you the current highest bidder?

Just been looking on Doinker website. The Elite is a whopping 10.3oz, the Fatty is 'only' 6.8oz.
She's selling some serious kit.

that will cope better than the cartel probably, but far from ideal, weights in the wrong place IMO

fatty only 0.8 oz heavier than the platinum dude. personally i don't need the doinker it comes with so this saves another 1/2oz or so.

other option if u worried about weight is the easton x10. stiff but some people feel too light and shocky, depending on your bow/poundage ofcourse.

32" x10 is 5oz, 28" 4.7, no 30". reckon the cartel is around 6 oz anyway.
 

lbp121

Member
I think there gets a point where the end weight has a negative effect by causing the pendulum motion you describe. The Beiter longrod has no end weight yet steadies the shot with it's stiffness.
A mix of end weight and flex means the bow can move around no matter how much weight is on the end. Therefore if you are determined to risk shoulder injury from heaving excess weight, you need to have a rod that will be stiff enough not to flex. That or reduce end weight to make existing rod less flexing.
 

geoffretired

Supporter
Supporter
I have forgotten who wrote on here about this last time .
I think the poster said that the thing to look out for is the frequency of the long rod matching the frequency of your bow arm movement. When that happens, once it starts it gets worse, as the long rod wobbles increase, and shake your aim even more.
I would guess that if you watch your sight to see what movements there are, it would be obvious if things were getting THAT bad.
 

GoneBad

Member
With the doinker elite can you remove the rubber bit at the end
I know you can remove the rubber at the weight end. Not sure about the riser end.
I reckon that if I just sawed the 'suppression mount' off the end, Geoffretired could make me a gadget to attach it to my bow out of some old teaspoons :rotfl:
 

jimlee

New member
ok I'll bite, I know that the issue of having the cap weights decoupled from the longrod by a rubber vibration suppressor was discussed at some depth on this forum a while ago, but I'm not totally convinced that there is any appreciable effect. To my mind, if you are putting enough energy into the bow by muscle spasms or whatever, to leave the cap weights behind and start a pendulum effect then I think you may have to have a chat with someone in the medical profession about Parkinsons disease or epilepsy. Having watched the Olympic archery today I noticed that an appreciable number of the competitors, including members of the Korean women's squad were using a version of the doinker vibration suppressor between longrod and weights and although you could see the end weights lashing up and down after the release it didn't seem to have too much of a detrimental effect on their aiming ability. Think I'll run for cover now after having kicked the wasps nest:running::running::stirthepo:bomb:

Cheers, Jim
 

Marcus26

New member
Nothing wrong with the Doinker Elite rods. The dampner on the end if fine, and also comes on the Platnium and Fatty rods.
The Platnium i not that bad of value for money. It's a little more expensive, yes, but comes with about $70AUD worth of weights with it. The Fatty does not.
I have the fatty setups and like them. I just got the Estremo setup and that's pretty awesome too.

With that much end weight a stiffer rod will be a big help, no doubt.
 

Phil Reay

New member
All getting too damn complicated for me. Got all that lot and they all live under the stairs in a nice dark atmosphere. Hoping they'll replicate while I shoot barebow.
 

jerryRTD

Active member
Yes you should get rid of that wibblely wobbley cartel long rod . It was only meant for recurves anyway. I like my fatty I have a 33.5 inch fatty with a 9 oz. stainless steel plate on the end.
The fatty on ebay is a little short you can get a 33.5 inch fatty from Bowsports for 79.99.
 
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