Riser advice

[A16KSB]

Hi all,
I’m looking to buy a high spec riser, at the moment the options are:
Hoyt GMX3
Winwin Meta DX
Winwin Radical Pro
I have big hands and think I prefer a medium to high grip, so getting after market grips or alternatives would be important. I intend to use the bow for Olympic Style archery, but may dabble in barebow.
I’ve been mainly shoot traditional under NFAS and EFAA.
Any advice and reasons why would be appreciated
TIA

 

[Timid Toad]

If you are looking for a high end, well-speced riser, designed for both Oly and Barebow, I'd recommend looking at the Border Tempest. It was initially designed as a Barebow riser, but a lot of people (me included) shoot it as an Olympic rig too. It comes with a myriad of finishes and colour choices, precision limb adjustment, a good selection of grip choices (all made by RCore for Border, but Hoyt style grips fit too), excellent balance and it's beautifully made in Scotland.
You don't say if you need a 25 or a 27" but both are available.
It's doing very well internationally in the field despite Border not sponsoring archers - every one you see shot will have been bought because the archer wants it - there's no freebies or cash bonuses.

 

[mbaker74]

With any of the risers you mention, no-one can tell you which to buy as all people prefer a different feel.... Any of them will shoot an olympic qualifying score in the right hands. You need to go and see and shoot them, get your hands on it with the limbs you are going to use and see how it feels, then pick the one you like best.

I went for an Uukha riser as I preferred the feel of it shooting over the top of the range Hoyt at the time.

 

[A16KSB]

If you are looking for a high end, well-speced riser, designed for both Oly and Barebow, I'd recommend looking at the Border Tempest. It was initially designed as a Barebow riser, but a lot of people (me included) shoot it as an Olympic rig too. It comes with a myriad of finishes and colour choices, precision limb adjustment, a good selection of grip choices (all made by RCore for Border, but Hoyt style grips fit too), excellent balance and it's beautifully made in Scotland.
You don't say if you need a 25 or a 27" but both are available.
It's doing very well internationally in the field despite Border not sponsoring archers - every one you see shot will have been bought because the archer wants it - there's no freebies or cash bonuses.

Yes, I'd forgotten about Border, they can produce some great bows, however I've had a few problems with Covert Hunters in the past. If there was a 2nd hand one available in the right colour I'd seriously consider it

 

[A16KSB]

With any of the risers you mention, no-one can tell you which to buy as all people prefer a different feel.... Any of them will shoot an olympic qualifying score in the right hands. You need to go and see and shoot them, get your hands on it with the limbs you are going to use and see how it feels, then pick the one you like best.

I went for an Uukha riser as I preferred the feel of it shooting over the top of the range Hoyt at the time.

ALl makes sense,

With any of the risers you mention, no-one can tell you which to buy as all people prefer a different feel.... Any of them will shoot an olympic qualifying score in the right hands. You need to go and see and shoot them, get your hands on it with the limbs you are going to use and see how it feels, then pick the one you like best.

I went for an Uukha riser as I preferred the feel of it shooting over the top of the range Hoyt at the time.

All makes sense, jusy need to find a shop that has them all in stock, thanks

 

[Stretch]

Little unsure how you got your pick list. They range from chalk to cheese. The Radical Pro has not been popular - at least not with international archers.

Some folks like the feel of carbon risers - some don’t. That should be easy enough for you to try. I wouldn’t expect to see a mix.

On the aluminium front I‘d add the ATF-DX and ATF-X. I’d also add the Gillo GT. if you’re not into “latest and greatest” I’d have a Xceed on the list too.

How heavy do you like to run your bows? The Tempest, which is very nicely put together, is great as a BB riser but if you like to run heavy stabilisers it gets heavy (although doesn’t feel as heavy due to the deflex). If you like to run a relatively light and pointy setup it seems happier (For me anyway). That may change as you go up draw weight - I’m only at about 42-43#. Mind you quite a lot of these are at the heavier end.

If you like a bow that punches at the target on release none of these are it (unless you take the dampers out of the GMX3 and the Meta which might make them a bit more punchy).

However, 99.9% of it is what you like the look of. They’ll all shoot as well as each other. Some might be hard to get them shooting that way but generally there is not that much in it.

If you want to spend a lot of money on Custom grips then rCore make for all of these and Jaeger for most of them. Not sue how much £ you have to add to clear VAT delivery payments. Milliput is cheaper.

Stretch

Stretch

 

[A16KSB]

Little unsure how you got your pick list. They range from chalk to cheese. The Radical Pro has not been popular - at least not with international archers.

Some folks like the feel of carbon risers - some don’t. That should be easy enough for you to try. I wouldn’t expect to see a mix.

On the aluminium front I‘d add the ATF-DX and ATF-X. I’d also add the Gillo GT. if you’re not into “latest and greatest” I’d have a Xceed on the list too.

How heavy do you like to run your bows? The Tempest, which is very nicely put together, is great as a BB riser but if you like to run heavy stabilisers it gets heavy (although doesn’t feel as heavy due to the deflex). If you like to run a relatively light and pointy setup it seems happier (For me anyway). That may change as you go up draw weight - I’m only at about 42-43#. Mind you quite a lot of these are at the heavier end.

If you like a bow that punches at the target on release none of these are it (unless you take the dampers out of the GMX3 and the Meta which might make them a bit more punchy).

However, 99.9% of it is what you like the look of. They’ll all shoot as well as each other. Some might be hard to get them shooting that way but generally there is not that much in it.

If you want to spend a lot of money on Custom grips then rCore make for all of these and Jaeger for most of them. Not sue how much £ you have to add to clear VAT delivery payments. Milliput is cheaper.

Stretch

Stretch

Hi thank you for your reply.
Bearing in mind I know very little about Olympic type risers, I dont understand why the range is chalk and cheese.
I chose the HOyt because it was launched as a riser that could be used for BB as well.
The Meta DX because i liked the idea of the dampners.
I spoke with a retailer and was told that the Radical Pro shot better than the Meta DX, so I' contacted this group to see if I could get some indenepdant advice.
I'm looking to shoot between 40 and 42, as I have lots of 600 spine arrows, which I hope to use on the new bow.
You've asked some good questions, e.g how heavy do I like my bows and if I like a abow that punches at the target, (not sure what you mean here), but I don't really have an answer as this is relatively new to me

 

[Stretch]

Hi, based on what you’re saying, pick the one you like the look of and colour the most. Honestly, nothing else is going to matter. What level are you shooting? Are you just picking the most expensive risers you can find? Not always a good idea. More things to tweak also equals more things to F* up.

Aluminium risers and carbon risers resonate in a different way. Some folks like the feel of Al. Others like the typically duller and damped feeling of the carbon. So in my case I just don’t like the feel of carbon risers. Some imagine that they’ll like carbon but when push comes to shove they don’t. You have to shoot it to understand. Look at the bows on the world archery finals field, there are a few carbon but mostly even the w&w archers are shooting the aluminium risers. This isn’t to say all carbon risers feel alike and all Al risers feel alike - there is a spectrum for each.

The second thing is the damping - you know the GMX3 also has dampers, they’re just in the pocket. So word seems to be it has a very neutral reaction but I’m guessing if you remove the dampers it’ll feel like a normal Hoyt.

If it is all new to you, I’d suggest respectfully that all of these will be too heavy for you and you should look at something in the less than 1300g area. 1200-1300g is a sweetspot. Heavy enough that most archers can get it to work. Light enough that most archers can set it up in a way it shoots well but doesn’t over strain them.

When you shoot the bow will tend to follow the arrow, it will leap forward towards the target to some extent. Some follow through in a quite punchy way and the bow hits the end of your sling. Others are more docile and just hop forward gently. Some folks like one way, other folks the reverse.

My personal opinion is that any dealer who says the Radical Pro shoots better than the Meta or ATF-DX has a Radical Pro in the storeroom that they haven’t managed to sell. Mind you, I know that W&W have rarely been able to persuade sponsored archers to shoot their weirder creations despite being adamant that they are, in their opinion, better designs. But to be frank if you have no real preferences established you’re better off with something tournament proven (like the ATF-DX as shot by the World #1 man). Personally I always seem to prefer Hoyts. I like my Xceed and not feeling the need to change it. If I was going exotic I’d look at the Border (I have one on loan and it is an excellent but totally differ bit of kit). ATF-x or ATF-DX are safe. I’d also include FIVICS in the mix here - they are definitely producing some nice looking bows (but I haven’t shot them). And of course, you’ll see archers like Furukawa who like carbon but last time I saw he was shooting the Meta DX with the dampers removed.

<Deep breath> you could probably spend a lot less and get something that fits your bill while you work out what you actually like.

Stretch

 

[Timid Toad]

Agree with the above -
Go for what you think looks nice. If you shoot something at the dealer it won't tell you how nice/horrible it is to shoot in real life once it's properly set up. What you will judge it on is the grip shape, and that can be changed, or options are available at point of purchase.

If you are a newish archer to an ali or carbon (as opposed to wood/phenolic) riser, I would definitely be looking at second hand. You'll get a proven riser at a good discount simply because the manufacturer has the 2024 model out, which of course is waaaay better than the 2023 version

Then, if you want to play with your grip (in my experience RCore are cheaper than Jager, more reliable, have a vast choice and will even make one to your specifications) you have funds to play with, and lets face it, the grip is the archer's only interface with the bow and seriously effects how it shoots.

 

[A16KSB]

Hi, based on what you’re saying, pick the one you like the look of and colour the most. Honestly, nothing else is going to matter. What level are you shooting? Are you just picking the most expensive risers you can find? Not always a good idea. More things to tweak also equals more things to F* up.

Aluminium risers and carbon risers resonate in a different way. Some folks like the feel of Al. Others like the typically duller and damped feeling of the carbon. So in my case I just don’t like the feel of carbon risers. Some imagine that they’ll like carbon but when push comes to shove they don’t. You have to shoot it to understand. Look at the bows on the world archery finals field, there are a few carbon but mostly even the w&w archers are shooting the aluminium risers. This isn’t to say all carbon risers feel alike and all Al risers feel alike - there is a spectrum for each.

The second thing is the damping - you know the GMX3 also has dampers, they’re just in the pocket. So word seems to be it has a very neutral reaction but I’m guessing if you remove the dampers it’ll feel like a normal Hoyt.

If it is all new to you, I’d suggest respectfully that all of these will be too heavy for you and you should look at something in the less than 1300g area. 1200-1300g is a sweetspot. Heavy enough that most archers can get it to work. Light enough that most archers can set it up in a way it shoots well but doesn’t over strain them.

When you shoot the bow will tend to follow the arrow, it will leap forward towards the target to some extent. Some follow through in a quite punchy way and the bow hits the end of your sling. Others are more docile and just hop forward gently. Some folks like one way, other folks the reverse.

My personal opinion is that any dealer who says the Radical Pro shoots better than the Meta or ATF-DX has a Radical Pro in the storeroom that they haven’t managed to sell. Mind you, I know that W&W have rarely been able to persuade sponsored archers to shoot their weirder creations despite being adamant that they are, in their opinion, better designs. But to be frank if you have no real preferences established you’re better off with something tournament proven (like the ATF-DX as shot by the World #1 man). Personally I always seem to prefer Hoyts. I like my Xceed and not feeling the need to change it. If I was going exotic I’d look at the Border (I have one on loan and it is an excellent but totally differ bit of kit). ATF-x or ATF-DX are safe. I’d also include FIVICS in the mix here - they are definitely producing some nice looking bows (but I haven’t shot them). And of course, you’ll see archers like Furukawa who like carbon but last time I saw he was shooting the Meta DX with the dampers removed.

<Deep breath> you could probably spend a lot less and get something that fits your bill while you work out what you actually like.

Stretch

Hi Stretch,
Firstly thank you for such a comprehensive reply.
The point about the most expensive probaly has some bearing on my choice, not becaus I'm rolling in cash, but my initial thoughts were buy good buy once, but my opinion has now changed. I recently shot a Win& Win Winnex fully loaded and just couldn't "Hold" it anywhere near the gold, at full draw I was always below it, if I raised it in line with the gold, I would relase at the instance, it could be the weight of the bow as you and others have mentioned, so a bit of physical conditioning and patience/training may be required
I shoot Trad, (AGB, NFAS and EFAA) to a pretty good standard and dont have this issue, granted the trad bow will be lighter than a Carbon or Ali.
Yes I agree with you about the dealer comment, haha.
I will have look at the Fivics range.
One again thanks for your help

 

[A16KSB]

Agree with the above -
Go for what you think looks nice. If you shoot something at the dealer it won't tell you how nice/horrible it is to shoot in real life once it's properly set up. What you will judge it on is the grip shape, and that can be changed, or options are available at point of purchase.

If you are a newish archer to an ali or carbon (as opposed to wood/phenolic) riser, I would definitely be looking at second hand. You'll get a proven riser at a good discount simply because the manufacturer has the 2024 model out, which of course is waaaay better than the 2023 version

Then, if you want to play with your grip (in my experience RCore are cheaper than Jager, more reliable, have a vast choice and will even make one to your specifications) you have funds to play with, and lets face it, the grip is the archer's only interface with the bow and seriously effects how it shoots.

Hi,
Thank you for this, buying second hand is something I've tried to stay away from, as there may be no guarantee of what I'm gettting, but maybe I'll have a look to get an idea for price range

 

[A16KSB]

Thanks to everyone that has replied, maybe a bit more research and patience is required by me, sometimes I get too impatience.

 

[Stretch]

Hi Stretch,
Firstly thank you for such a comprehensive reply.
The point about the most expensive probaly has some bearing on my choice, not becaus I'm rolling in cash, but my initial thoughts were buy good buy once, but my opinion has now changed. I recently shot a Win& Win Winnex fully loaded and just couldn't "Hold" it anywhere near the gold, at full draw I was always below it, if I raised it in line with the gold, I would relase at the instance, it could be the weight of the bow as you and others have mentioned, so a bit of physical conditioning and patience/training may be required
I shoot Trad, (AGB, NFAS and EFAA) to a pretty good standard and dont have this issue, granted the trad bow will be lighter than a Carbon or Ali.
Yes I agree with you about the dealer comment, haha.
I will have look at the Fivics range.
One again thanks for your help

This could be mass but it could also be:

1. Grip shape and your hand
2. Bow tiller being too high for you
3. Stabiliser mass/distribution
4. … etc

First olympic setup type bow should shot with just a longrod and a couple of oz of weight. Then you work up to fully loaded… your fully loaded and my fully loaded won‘t often be the same.

However, your approach is sensible - the Winnex is quite light as I recall. Also worth saying that buy expensive buy once is rarely an archery thing… occasionally people find their “forever” bow but not often.

Stretch

 

[AzShooter]

Don't go by looks, go by feel. Try each of the models you suggested and see what feels most comfortable in your hand. As someone if you can actually shoot it. This will give you a feel for the limbs and how they stack or don't.

40 - 42 pounds will get you there, that's what I shot when I shot Olympic style. As you get more proficient you may want to invest in heavier limbs.

Hoyts always felt good in my hands btw.

Good luck and good shooting.

 

[A16KSB]

Hi all,
I’m looking to buy a high spec riser, at the moment the options are:
Hoyt GMX3
Winwin Meta DX
Winwin Radical Pro
I have big hands and think I prefer a medium to high grip, so getting after market grips or alternatives would be important. I intend to use the bow for Olympic Style archery, but may dabble in barebow.
I’ve been mainly shoot traditional under NFAS and EFAA.
Any advice and reasons why would be appreciated
TIA

Hi all,
I’m looking to buy a high spec riser, at the moment the options are:
Hoyt GMX3
Winwin Meta DX
Winwin Radical Pro
I have big hands and think I prefer a medium to high grip, so getting after market grips or alternatives would be important. I intend to use the bow for Olympic Style archery, but may dabble in barebow.
I’ve been mainly shoot traditional under NFAS and EFAA.
Any advice and reasons why would be appreciated
TIA

Update,
I managed to get practically brand new Gilo GT 25" for a very good price
Now considering I normally shoot traditional, this riser had a completely different feel to it, and something I liked. it seemed steadier and more balanced. I not just saying this because I bought it and need to justify the purchase. If I didn't like it I would say.
The weight, balance and after shot feel, could have been the same with the Hoyt or Win & WIn, I'd never know. All I can say is it feel different to a wood/phenolic bow.
I intend to use it as a full recurve setup every now and then.
Thanks for all your advice and help
PS it is meant to be a Black and Gold riser, the Gold is more like a rusty colour, I think they increased the lights in the studio when the took stock photos, haha

 

[LAC Mark]

I have a "Gold" Gillo Gt and you're right it does look more like rusty orange.
They have changed to more gold gold, so the website is probably showing the new one.

 

[A16KSB]

I have a "Gold" Gillo Gt and you're right it does look more like rusty orange.
They have changed to more gold gold, so the website is probably showing the new one.

Thanks, wish you hadn't told me that now haha, I will now see if the Gold bits are available as spares

 

[LAC Mark]

Thanks, wish you hadn't told me that now haha, I will now see if the Gold bits are available as spares

I believe they are, not looked myself as I know what will happen £££££